加载中…
个人资料
天上的枫叶
天上的枫叶
  • 博客等级:
  • 博客积分:0
  • 博客访问:8,373
  • 关注人气:4
  • 获赠金笔:0支
  • 赠出金笔:0支
  • 荣誉徽章:
相关博文
推荐博文
谁看过这篇博文
加载中…
正文 字体大小:

Sir Ken Robinson: Bring on the learning revolution!

(2010-11-25 08:49:05)
标签:

杂谈

I was here four years ago, and I remember, at the time, that the talks weren't put online; I think they were given to TEDsters in a box, a box set of DVDs, which they put on their shelves, where they are now.

四年前我在这儿演过讲,当时,TED的演讲还没有放到网上;当时这些演讲应该是放在一个盒子——一盒DVD——送给TED与会者,然后与会者们又把盒子放到架子上,束之高阁。

(Laughter)

(笑声)

And actually Chris called me a week after I'd given my talk and he said, "We're going to start putting them online. Can we put yours online?" And I said, "Sure."

而实际上,在我演讲后过了一周,克里斯打电话告诉我说:“我们将会把TED的演讲放到网上。我们能把你的演讲放到网上吗?”我说:“当然。”

And four years later, as I said, it's been seen by four ... Well, it's been downloaded four million times. So I suppose you could multiply that by 20 or something to get the number of people who've seen it. And as Chris says, there is a hunger for videos of me.

四年后,这个演讲被观看过了四......嗯,被下载了四百万次。我估计看过的人数还得乘上个二十左右。而正如克里斯所说,人们如饥似渴似的希望获得更多我做的演讲。

(Laughter)

(笑声)

(Applause)

(掌声)

... don't you feel?

难道你们不这么觉得吗?

(Laughter)

(笑声)

So, this whole event has been an elaborate build-up to me doing another one for you, so here it is.

因此,在TED这场精心准备的大会上,我准备再进行一次演讲,也就是这次演讲了。

(Laughter)

(笑声)

Al Gore spoke at the TED Conference I spoke at four years ago and talked about the climate crisis.And I referenced that at the end of my last talk. So I want to pick up from there because I only had 18 minutes, frankly. So, as I was saying...

四年前我在这儿演讲时,戈尔也在TED大会上发表演讲。他谈到了气候危机。而我在上次演讲的结尾处提到了戈尔所说的。我想旧事重提,从那儿开始讲,因为坦白地讲,我只有十八分钟。正如我当时说的......

(Laughter)

(笑声)

You see, he's right. I mean, there is a major climate crisis, obviously. And I think if people don't believe it, they should get out more. (Laughter) But I believe there's a second climate crisis, which is as severe, which has the same origins, and that we have to deal with with the same urgency. And I mean by this -- and you may say, by the way, "Look, I'm good. I have one climate crisis; I don't really need the second one." But this is a crisis of, not natural resources, though I believe that's true,but a crisis of human resources.

戈尔是对的。很显然,一场严重的气候危机正在发生。如果人们不相信的话,他们应该多出去走走。(笑声)而我认为还有第二种气候危机,这危 机和第一种同样严重,有着相同的根源,我们应该以和对待第一种气候危机一样的紧迫性去对待它。我是这么认为的,你可能会说,“看看,我好得很。我有一种气 候危机了,我不想要第二种了。”但这场危机并不是自然资源的危机——但我认为这场危机是真实存在的——而是人力资源的危机。

I believe, fundamentally, as many speakers have said during the past few days, that we make very poor use of our talents. Very many people go through their whole lives having no real sense of what their talents may be, or if they have any to speak of. I meet all kinds of people who don't think they're really good at anything.

我认为,正如许多演讲者在过去几天中所说的那样,从根本上而言,我们对于自己天赋的运用极其可怜。许多人在对自己的天赋可能是什么——或是自己有什么值得称道的特长——没有清晰的认识的情况下度过了一生。我遇到过各种各样认为自己一无所长的人。

Actually, I kind of divide the world into two groups now. Jeremy Bentham, the great utilitarian philosopher, once spiked this argument. He said, "There are two types of people in this world, those who divide the world into two types and those who do not." (Laughter) Well, I do. (Laughter)

实际上,我现在将世界划分为两个群体。伟大功利主义哲学家的杰里米·边沁(Jeremy Bentham)曾私下说过。他说道:“世界上有两种人,一种是将世界划分为两种人的人,一种是不这么划分的人。”(笑声)而我是那种将世界划分成两种人的人。(笑声)

I meet all kinds of people who don't enjoy what they do. They simply go through their lives getting on with it. They get no great pleasure from what they do. They endure it, rather than enjoy it, and wait for the weekend. But I also meet people who love what they do and couldn't imagine doing anything else. If you said to them, "Don't do this anymore," they'd wonder what you were talking about. Because it isn't what they do, it's who they are.They say, "But this is me, you know. It would be foolish for me to abandon this, because it speaks to my most authentic self." And it's not true of enough people. In fact, on the contrary, I think it's certainly a minority of people. And I think there are many possible explanations for it. And high among them is education, because education, in a way,dislocates very many people from their natural talents. And human resources are like natural resources; they're often buried deep. You have to go looking for them. They're not just lying around on the surface. You have to create the circumstances where they show themselves. And you might imagine education would be the way that happens. But too often, it's not. Every education system in the world is being reformed at the moment. And it's not enough. Reform is no use anymore, because that's simply improving a broken model. What we need -- and the word's been used many times during the course of the past few days -- is not evolution, but a revolution in education. This has to be transformed into something else.

我遇到过各种各样不喜欢自己所从事的工作的人。他们从事着那份工作度过 一生。从自己所从事的工作中,他们得不到任何快乐。他们坚持地——而非享受地——做着这份工作,然后熬到周末。但我同样也遇到过喜欢自己所从事的工作的 人,这些人不能想象自己还会去做其他事情。如果你跟他们说:“不要再做这件事了”,他们会想,你到底在说什么啊。因为这不是他们在做什么事,而是这就是他 们。 他们会说:“但这就是我。如果不做这件事,那我就是傻 了,因为这份工作代表了最真实的我。”对于很多人来说,事情并不是这样的。相反,我认为,这仅存在于小部分人中。这件事情有许多可能的解释。而最大的原因 就是教育,因为教育作为一种手段,将许多人和他们的天赋相剥离。而人力资源和自然资源很相像:它们通常都埋藏得很深。必须得去寻找它们。它们不会仅仅是躺 在地面上,还必须创造让它们展示自己的环境。你也许会想教育就是创造这种环境的方法。但通常,不是这样的。目前,世界上每一种教育体系都在经历改革。但这 还不够。改革不再有用了,因为改革仅仅是在修补一个破损的模型。我们需要的——这个词在过去几天用到了很多次——不是教育的进化,而是革命。目前的教育体 系必须转变。

(Applause)

(掌声)

One of the real challenges is to innovate fundamentally in education. Innovation is hard because it means doing something that people don't find very easy for the most part. It means challenging what we take for granted, things that we think are obvious. The great problem for reform or transformation is the tyranny of common sense, things that people think, "Well, it can't be done any other way because that's the way it's done."

真正的挑战之一在于从基本上对教育进行创新。创新很困难,因为这意味要做一些人们在大部分情况下都觉得不容易做的事情。创新意味着挑战我们认为理所 当然的事情,挑战我们认为很明显的事情。革命或转变面临的大难题就是常识的独裁,人们认为:“事情不可能用其他方法解决,因为它就该这么做。“

I came across a great quote recently from Abraham Lincoln, who I thought you'd be pleased to have quoted at this point. (Laughter) He said this in December 1862 to the second annual meeting of Congress. I ought to explain that I have no idea what was happening at the time. We don't teach American history in Britain. (Laughter) We suppress it. You know, this is our policy.(Laughter) So, no doubt, something fascinating was happening in December 1862, which the Americans among us will be aware of.

最近,亚伯拉罕·林肯的一句话让我感触很深,我想你会很高兴在这儿听到这段话。(笑声)林肯是在1862年12月举行的第二次国会年度会议 (annual meeting of Congress)上发表的上述讲话。需要说明的是,我对当时发生了什么一无所知。在英国,我们不教授美国历史。(笑声)我们掩盖美国历史。这是我们的政 策。(笑声)毫无疑问,1862年12月发生了一些很棒的事情,听众中的美国人应该会知道。

But he said this: "The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is piled high with difficulty, and we must rise with the occasion." I love that. Not rise to it, rise with it. "As our case is new, so we must think anew and act anew We must disenthrall ourselves and then we shall save our country."

林肯说道:“寂静过去的教条已不适应暴烈的当下。形势的确困难重重,而我们必须顺势而起。”我喜欢这句话。不是应对它,而是顺势而起。“由于我们的问题是新问题,我们必须以新的方法思考和行动。我们必须解放(disenthrall)自己,然后我们将拯救我们的国家。”

I love that word, "disenthrall." You know what it means? That there are ideas that all of us are enthralled to, which we simply take for granted as the natural order of things, the way things are. And many of our ideas have been formed, not to meet the circumstances of this century, but to cope with the circumstances of previous centuries. But our minds are still hypnotized by them. And we have to disenthrall ourselves of some of them. Now, doing this is easier said than done. It's very hard to know, by the way, what it is you take for granted.And the reason is that you take it for granted.

我喜欢“disenthrall”(解放)这个词。你知道这个词意味着什么?这个词的意思是:有许多我们所有人都简单地接受并理所当然地认为属于事 物自然秩序或运行规则的观念。而这些观念中的许多之所以形成是为应对之前几个世纪中遇到的问题,而非当前的问题。但我们的思想仍旧浑然未觉。我们必须将自 己从其中一些观点中解放出来。现在,这件事易说难做。而且,很难说什么是你认为理所当然的事情。因为你理所当然地接受了这些事情。

So let me ask you something that you may take for granted. How many of you here are over the age of 25? That's not what I think you take for granted. I'm sure you're familiar with that already. Are there any people here under the age of 25? Great. Now, those over 25, could you put your hands up if you're wearing a wristwatch? Now that's a great deal of us, isn't it? Ask a room full of teenagers the same thing. 

让我来问你一些你认为理所当然的事情。在座的人中有多少是25岁以上的?这不是我所说的理所当然的事情。你们肯定知道自己的年龄吧。在座的有多少是25岁以下的?很好。现在请那些25岁以上戴着手表的人举起手来好吗?很多人,不是吗?如果问一屋子都是年轻人这个问题呢?

Teenagers do not wear wristwatches. I don't mean they can't or they're not allowed to, they just often choose not to. And the reason is, you see, that we were brought up in a pre-digital culture, those of us over 25. And so for us, if you want to know the time, you have to wear something to tell it. Kids now live in a world which is digitized, and the time, for them, is everywhere.They see no reason to do this. And, by the way, you don't need to do it either; it's just that you've always done it, and you carry on doing it. My daughter never wears a watch, my daughter Kate, who's 20. She doesn't see the point. As she says, "It's a single function device." (Laughter) "Like, how lame is that?" And I say, "No, no, it tells the date as well." (Laughter) "It has multiple functions."

年轻人不戴手表。我并不是说他们不能或者不被允许戴手表,他们经常选择不戴手表。而原因是,我们是在前数字文化中长大的人,那些25岁以上的人。对 于我们而言,如果想要知道时间,我们就得戴一些计时的东西。年轻人们现在生活在一个数字化的世界中,而对于他们而言,时间无处不在。他们找不到任何戴手表 的理由。而且,也不需要手表。戴手表是因为之前总是戴,所以一直在戴。我女儿凯特现在20岁。她就不懂为什么要戴手表。正如她所说的,这是个单功能设 备。(笑声)手表多无聊啊。而我说:“不,不,手表还能显示日期。”(笑声)“手表有多种功能。”

But you see, there are things we're enthralled to in education. Let me give you a couple of examples.One of them is the idea of linearity, that it starts here, and you go through a track, and if you do everything right, you will end up set for the rest of your life. Everybody who's spoken at TED has told us implicitly, or sometimes explicitly, a different story, that life is not linear, it's organic. We create our lives symbiotically as we explore our talents in relation to the circumstances they help to create for us. But you know, we have become obsessed with this linear narrative. And probably the pinnacle for education is getting into college. I think we are obsessed with getting people to college, certain sorts of college. I don't mean you shouldn't go to college, but not everybody needs to go, and not everybody needs to go now. Maybe they go later, not right away.

在教育上,我们也被很多事情牢牢吸引。让我来举几个例子。其中一个就是线性思维:从这儿开始,沿着一条轨迹,如果一切都做对了,你将沿着这条轨迹度 过余生。每一个在TED做过演讲的人都会暗暗——有时会很详尽——地提到另一个不同的故事,生命不是线性的,而是有机的。我们的生命和环境是共生的,在我 们探索自己的天赋与环境的关系时,环境也创造了我们。而我们对线性叙述沉溺过度了。教育的顶峰也许就是进入大学。我认为对于让人们上大学——上一些特定的 大学,人们过度执著于此了。我并不是说你不该上大学,但并不是每个人都需要上大学,而且也不是每个人马上都需要上大学。也许他们会晚些上大学,而不是马 上。

And I was up in San Francisco a while ago doing a book signing. There was this guy buying a book, he was in his 30s. And I said, "What do you do?"And he said, "I'm a fireman." And I said, "How long have you been a fireman?" He said, "Always, I've always been a fireman." And I said, "Well, when did you decide?" He said, "As a kid." He said, "Actually, it was a problem for me at school,because at school, everybody wanted to be a fireman." He said, "But I wanted to be a fireman."And he said, "When I got to the senior year of school, my teachers didn't take it seriously. This one teacher didn't take it seriously. He said I was throwing my life away if that's all I chose to do with it, that I should go to college, I should become a professional person, that I had great potential,and I was wasting my talent to do that." And he said, "It was humiliating because he said it in front of the whole class, and I really felt dreadful.But it's what I wanted, and as soon as I left school, I applied to the fire service and I was accepted." And he said, "You know, I was thinking about that guy recently, just a few minutes ago when you were speaking, about this teacher," he said, "because six months ago, I saved his life."(Laughter) He said, "He was in a car wreck, and I pulled him out, gave him CPR, and I saved his wife's life as well." He said, "I think he thinks better of me now."

不久前,我去旧金山举行一场图书签售会。有个人买了本书,那人大概30岁。我说:“你做什么?”他回答道:“我是消防队员。”我又说:“你做消防队 员多久了?”他说:“一直都在做,我一直都是消防队员。”然后我又问道:“哦,你什么时候决定要做消防队员的?”那人答道:“小孩时就想了,实际上,在我 上学时这还是个问题,因为学校里每个人都想当消防队员。而我也想当消防队员。当我上到高年级时,我的老师们并没有把这太当真。这个老师并没有太当真。他告 诉我说如果我去当消防队员,我就是浪费了我的人生。他说我应该去上大学。这很羞辱人,因为他是当着全班人的面说的,而我对此感觉非常糟糕。但我就想当消防 队员,当我一离开学校,我就申请去消防系统,然后我被录用了。就在你演讲的前几分钟,我还在想这位老师。因为六个月前,我救了他的命。(笑声)他当时在一 辆车的残骸里,我将他拉了出来,给他做心肺复苏术,我还救了他妻子的命。我想现在他对我看法好点了吧。”

(Laughter)

(笑声)

(Applause)

(掌声)

You know, to me, human communities depend upon a diversity of talent, not a singular conception of ability. And at the heart of our challenges -- (Applause) At the heart of the challenge is to reconstitute our sense of ability and of intelligence. This linearity thing is a problem.

对我而言,人类社区依靠的是天赋的多样性,而不是对能力的单一概念。而我们所遇见的挑战的核心就是重建我们对于能力或智力的认知。线性认知是个麻烦。

When I arrived in L.A. about nine years ago, I came across a policy statement, very well-intentioned, which said, "College begins in kindergarten." No, it doesn't. (Laughter) It doesn't.If we had time, I could go into this, but we don't.(Laughter) Kindergarten begins in kindergarten.(Laughter) A friend of mine once said, "You know, a three year-old is not half a six year-old."(Laughter) (Applause) They're three.

当我在九年前到洛杉矶时,我看到了一条政策宣言,意图非常好。那条宣言写道:“大学始于幼儿园”。不,不是这样的。(笑声)不是这样的。如果我们有 时间的话,我会进一步探讨这个问题,但我们没有。(笑声)幼儿园就是幼儿园。(笑声)我一个朋友曾说:“三岁并不是六岁的一半。”(笑声)(掌声)他们才 三岁。

But as we just heard in this last session, there's such competition now to get to kindergarten, to get to the right kindergarten, that people are being interviewed for it at three. Kids sitting in front of unimpressed panels, you know, with their resumes, (Laughter) flipping through and saying, "Well, this is it?" (Laughter) (Applause) "You've been around for 36 months, and this is it?"(Laughter) "You've achieved nothing, commit. Spent the first six months breastfeeding, the way I can see it." (Laughter) See, it's outrageous as a conception, but it attracts people.

而在上一次大会上,我们听到,现在进幼儿园——进好的幼儿园——竞争得很厉害!在三岁时就得面试才能进幼儿园。孩子们坐在无动于衷的评委们面前,带 着自己的简历,(笑声)专家们翻了翻然后说:“就这些?”(笑声)(掌声)“你生下了36个月了,就会这些?”(笑声)“承认吧,你啥都没达成。前六个月 在吃奶,还是用我知道的方法。”(笑声)看,这种认知让人很恼火,但却吸引着人们。

The other big issue is conformity. We have built our education systems on the model of fast food.T his is something Jamie Oliver talked about the other day. You know there are two models of quality assurance in catering. One is fast food,where everything is standardized. The other are things like Zagat and Michelin restaurants, where everything is not standardized, they're customized to local circumstances. And we have sold ourselves into a fast food model of education. And it's impoverishing our spirit and our energies as much as fast food is depleting our physical bodies.

另一个重要议题旧是统一性。我们的教育系统是基于快餐模式建造的。这也是杰米·奥立佛(Jamie Oliver)几天前所说的。在餐饮业有两种质量保证模式。一种是快餐模式,所有事情都能标准化。另一种则是像查氏餐馆(Zagat)或米其林餐馆 (Michelin)模式,所有事情都是非标准化的,而是针对本土环境定制的。而我们则将自己出售给了一种快餐模式教育。这种教育让我们精神浅薄化,精力 疲乏化,就像快餐摧毁我们的健康一样。

(Applause)

(掌声)

I think we have to recognize a couple of things here. One is that human talent is tremendously diverse. People have very different aptitudes. I worked out recently that I was given a guitar as a kid at about the same time Eric Clapton got his first guitar. You know, it worked out for Eric, that's all I'm saying. (Laughter) In a way, it did not for me. I could not get this thing to work no matter how often or how hard I blew into it. It just wouldn't work.

我认为我们在此必须认清一些事情。其中之一就是人的天赋极其多样化。人类拥有许多不同的天资。最近我算了算,在我还是孩子时,我拿到了一把吉他,那 时也是埃里克·克拉普顿(Eric Clapton)拿到他第一把吉他的时候。但埃里克玩吉他玩得很好。这就是我要说的。(笑声)在吉他上,我不行。不管我玩吉他多少次或多么努力地投入吉 他,就是不行。

But it's not only about that. It's about passion.Often, people are good at things they don't really care for. It's about passion, and what excites our spirit and our energy. And if you're doing the thing that you love to do, that you're good at, time takes a different course entirely. My wife's just finished writing a novel, and I think it's a great book, but she disappears for hours on end. You know this, if you're doing something you love, an hour feels like five minutes. If you're doing something that doesn't resonate with your spirit, five minutes feels like an hour. And the reason so many people are opting out of education is because it doesn't feed their spirit, it doesn't feed their energy or their passion.

但不仅仅是这些。这还和激情有关。通常,人们擅长于自己不关心的事情。这和激情以及什么能刺激我们的精神、能量有关。如果你在做你自己喜欢做同时又 擅长的事情时,时间轨迹会截然不同。我妻子最近完成了一部小说,我觉得这是部很好的小说,但她为想个结尾而失踪了数小时。大家知道的,如果做自己喜欢做的 事情,一个小时就像五分钟。如果你做那些并不能触动你精神的事情,五分钟就像一小时。而许多人之所以不愿意接受教育是因为:教育既不能充实他们的精神,也 不能补充他们的精力或激情。

So I think we have to change metaphors. We have to go from what is essentially an industrial model of education, a manufacturing model, which is based on linearity and conformity and batching people. We have to move to a model that is based more on principles of agriculture. We have to recognize that human flourishing is not a mechanical process, it's an organic process. And you cannot predict the outcome of human development; all you can do, like a farmer, is create the conditions under which they will begin to flourish.

因此,我认为我们必须要改变象征。我们必须远离这种从根本上而言属于工业模式的教育,这种组装模式的教育是基于线性、一致性以及对人的标准化。我们 必须转至一个更多基于农业原则的教育系统。我们必须认识到,人类繁荣不是一个机械过程,而是一个有机过程。人们也不能预测个人发展的结果;人们所能做的就 是和农民一样,创造让人成长的环境。

So when we look at reforming education and transforming it, it isn't like cloning a system. There are great ones like KIPPs, it's a great system.There are many great models. It's about customizing to your circumstances, and personalizing education to the people you're actually teaching. And doing that, I think is the answer to the future because it's not about scaling a new solution; it's about creating a movement in education in which people develop their own solutions, but with external support based on a personalized curriculum.

当我们准备要改革并且转变教育体系时应该知道,这并不像克隆一个系统一样简单。有像KIPPs这样非常棒的教育模式,这是个非常棒的教育系统。而且 还有其他非常棒的教育模型。这些模式针对具体环境进行定制,并根据所教授的人进行个性化。而我认为这样做才是教育的未来,这不是创造一种新方法的问题,而 是要在创造一次教育运动,从而让人们能够开发出自己的方法,同时又能得到基于个性化课程这样的外在支持。

Now, in this room, there are people who represent extraordinary resources in business, in multimedia, in the internet. These technologies,combined with the extraordinary talents of teachers, provide an opportunity to revolutionize education. And I urge you to get involved in it because it's vital, not just to ourselves, but to the future of our children. but we have to change from the industrial model to an agricultural model,where each school can be flourishing tomorrow.That's where children experience life. Or at home, if that's where they choose to be educated with their families or their friends.

现在,在这间房子里,许多人在商业、多媒体、互联网领域中拥有巨量资源。这些技术,配合教师们的卓越才能,将提供教育革命的机会。我再次热烈呼吁大 家参与到这一过程中来,因为教育革命至关重要,不仅仅对我们是这样,对我们孩子的未来也一样。但要这么做。我们必须从工业模式转向农业模式,这样每所学校 都能在未来繁荣。学校是孩子们体验生活的地方。或者是家里,如果他们选择跟家人或朋友们一起接受教育的话。

There's been a lot of talk about dreams over the course of this few days. And I wanted to just very quickly -- I was very struck by Natalie Merchant's songs last night, recovering old poems. I wanted to read you a quick, very short poem from W.B. Yeats, who's someone you may know. He wrote this to his love, Maud Gonne, and he was bewailing the fact that he couldn't really give her what he thought she wanted from him. And he says, "I've got something else, but it may not be for you."

这几天来有许多演讲是关于梦想的。我想要非常快地……昨晚我被Natalie Merchant恢复古代诗歌的歌曲所感动。我想快速地给大家读一首叶芝的短诗,在座的人中也许有人知道他。这首诗是他写给他的爱人Maud Gonne的,他以为Maud想要从他那得到些什么,然后他认为自己不能给Maud这些。于是他写道:“我有其他一些东西,但这些东西可能不是你想要 的。”

He says this: "Had I the heavens embroidered cloths, Enwrought with gold and silver light, The blue and the dim and the dark cloths of night and light and the half-light, I would spread the cloths under your feet; But I, being poor, have only my dreams; I have spread my dreams under your feet; Tread softly because you tread on my dreams." And every day, everywhere, our children spread their dreams beneath our feet. And we should tread softly.

他写道:“Had I the heavens embroidered cloths, Enwrought with gold and silver light, The blue and the dim and the dark cloths of night and light and the half-light, I would spread the cloths under your feet; But I, being poor, have only my dreams; I have spread my dreams under your feet; Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.”(假如我有天国的锦绣绸缎,那用金色银色的光线织就,湛蓝、灰暗和漆黑的锦缎,黑夜、白天、黎明和傍晚,我就把那锦缎铺在你脚下;可我, 一贫如洗,只有梦;我把我的梦铺在了你脚下;轻点,因为你踏着我的梦。——傅浩译)每一天,每一处,我们的孩子都将他们的梦想放到我们的脚下。而我们应该 轻轻地踏过。

Thank you.

谢谢。

(Applause)

(掌声)

Thank you very much.

非常感谢

0

阅读 评论 收藏 转载 喜欢 打印举报/Report
  • 评论加载中,请稍候...
发评论

    发评论

    以上网友发言只代表其个人观点,不代表新浪网的观点或立场。

      

    新浪BLOG意见反馈留言板 电话:4000520066 提示音后按1键(按当地市话标准计费) 欢迎批评指正

    新浪简介 | About Sina | 广告服务 | 联系我们 | 招聘信息 | 网站律师 | SINA English | 会员注册 | 产品答疑

    新浪公司 版权所有